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Post by OrochiGeese on Jul 21, 2007 12:21:15 GMT -5
Glad you like it! You likely have at least one (or even two) wrestlers that would fit in to the team you wanted to use, right? Mmmm...rotisserie chicken ;D
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mike
Dark Matter
Posts: 12
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Post by mike on Jul 22, 2007 8:16:59 GMT -5
Not really, actually. But with the start of the league not taking place until March I figure I have plenty of time to come up with something.
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Post by OrochiGeese on Jul 22, 2007 11:40:16 GMT -5
Isn't there another wrestler or two in the same faction as the two you wanted to enter? I thought that particular faction had like three or four wrestlers altogether by the time VWA finished its last story cycle. In any case, it's no problem either way cause you really do have til next year for the league to start. March itself is a pretty early estimate as between planning and taking a brief break after the singles league concludes, I'll likely need even more time. So take your time figuring things out I want to make sure that everyone who wants to be involved in the tag league IS and is comfortable with their teams. I also want to iron out all the rules for allowing 3 man and 4 man teams and the trade-offs that may need to happen due to that. So we've gots time On that topic, does anyone have any ideas on how to balance allowing both 3-man and 4-man teams in the league while keeping it fair from a fatigue/selection standpoint? Maybe we disqualify one member each week for the 4 man teams and say who that is so that they aren't eligible for competition OR there to throw competing teams off. (that way 3-man team won't have to worry about Wrestler 4 being on 4-man team this specific week and can just decide who out of the remaining 3 is in the actual tag team). Idears? We can actually simplify things a bit, though at the cost of some strategy. Maybe for 4 man teams, we do this: The person who is involved in the fall (pin/sub/KO/DQ) the previous match is OUT of consideration for the following round of league shows. So say that Martin Fairbairn wins a match one show/round, then the following show he isn't even eligible to compete for his team, leaving the 3 remaining PTFW wrestlers to decide which two of them to be on the team. This could help make things a bit easier in deciding how to balance out the 4 man teams in line with the 3 man teams.
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Davey
Warp Driver'91
...yare yare...
Posts: 191
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Post by Davey on Jul 22, 2007 12:57:33 GMT -5
I was thinking that EVERYONE must compete every week. Like for example, if it's Stuart/VD vs. Martin/Park, then there'd also be like an 8 man tag earlier on where Hyun-Soo/Cliff/Fuchs/Jack are vs. 4 other free members of other teams(no writeup, maybe just a video or a quick summary) to even it oot a bit.
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Davey
Warp Driver'91
...yare yare...
Posts: 191
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Post by Davey on Jul 22, 2007 12:59:09 GMT -5
Also, while I know it's impossible for everyone to fight every week, maybe there could be "rest week", where each wrestler is rotated out for a week's holiday kinda thing.
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Post by OrochiGeese on Jul 22, 2007 13:35:18 GMT -5
The idea of having everyone in the faction (besides just the two man team for that week) wrestle each week is good but it does raise some potential difficulties:
1) Not every team is gonna be 4 man. So there will be some left over people unless we have EXACTLY the same amount of 3 man teams as we have 4 man teams (to ensure equal "extra" tag matches for the left over two members 4 man factions and singles for the left over single members of the 3 man factions)
2) I think the shows MIGHT be long enough that having extra non-league matches (even with league participants) on the show is a bit too much. If we look at the Singles shows, that has 6 matches and that's a lot. I'm expecting us to have a lot of teams at this point, though I'm not sure how many we will have.
Right now we have 12 singles wrestlers in that league. That gives us an even 6 matches per show. I doubt we'll have 12 teams...ESPECIALLY since we're making it faction based. If we have 6 teams, that gives us 3 league matches and then maybe room for another 3 non-league tallied matches with the remaining members of each faction not in the league match. So what you're saying IS possible. I guess I'll have to think more about this once we get the final tally of all the teams (and how many are 3 or 4 man teams).
However, if we don't go for that, the idea of the "rest week" works. The question is whether we have it mandatory or based on wins/losses from the previous week as I had mentioned earlier. If we stipulate from the start of the league which members will have rest weeks on each day. OR if we make it so that whoever on that team won or lost the previous week HAS to sit out the following week to ensure others are involved. That would help make sure that you don't have a tank in every match (since as soon as they win, they're out the next show) and also that a particularly weak member doesn't screw the team over.
It can ALSO allow some strategy. Let's say Orochi Army is set to face LRI on week 2. That makes it less likely that OrochiGeese will want to be involved against a potentially weaker team in week 1 cause he'll want to make sure he's eligible to face Jack Dod in week 2. So a lot of strategy with the "Win/lose and you're out next week" plan. I kinda like that IF we decide to have rest weeks for people.
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mike
Dark Matter
Posts: 12
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Post by mike on Jul 23, 2007 11:09:19 GMT -5
(No real reason for all the cloak and dagger ...)
The last version of the Freedom Brigade was not one I was real happy with, as Rhodey Colosso's giant size makes him way too strong and David DaVinci is just a world class tool.
But the Freedom Brigade has had many different people aid them in their cause against the enemies of Free Enterprise so it stands to reason Captain Kickass and his right hand man Red Coogan could easily recruit others to their cause.
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Post by motosada on Jul 23, 2007 14:11:51 GMT -5
How long a period of time will there be between League shows? If it's more than two weeks, I don't see much point in removing someone from the team selection process for "recovery", since any fatigue should've been eliminated in two weeks. An injury could bar them, but not fatigue.
Plus, the "involved in fall" rule hurts 3-man teams for the simple reason that you'd always know what team you'll be facing after the first show. Plus, what if someone wants to use a 2-man team? Obviously, the fall rule wouldn't apply, but that'd put them at a seemingly-constant disadvantage, since other teams could specifically play to their weaknesses and potential fatigue.
I do like the idea of giving either individual wrestlers or even whole teams a bye week. We would just need enough teams to make it work, if we were doing teams.
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Post by OrochiGeese on Jul 23, 2007 15:40:36 GMT -5
(No real reason for all the cloak and dagger ...) But the Freedom Brigade has had many different people aid them in their cause against the enemies of Free Enterprise so it stands to reason Captain Kickass and his right hand man Red Coogan could easily recruit others to their cause. Yeah I was thinking of Rhodey and Da Vinci as the previous two members but if you're into using other guys, that totally works too. Maybe they can bribe Mercer Vaelen into joining their team along with another Btw, this may be a fantastic opportunity to enter the Brickton Curs to get them some more exposure. And storyline-wise, I think it could work as well given some things that we know about them. How long a period of time will there be between League shows? If it's more than two weeks, I don't see much point in removing someone from the team selection process for "recovery", since any fatigue should've been eliminated in two weeks. An injury could bar them, but not fatigue. I expect a similar schedule as with the Singles league, meaning that we'd have a show every other week. So I do think recovery would work well here and add that extra strategic dynamic. Plus, the "involved in fall" rule hurts 3-man teams for the simple reason that you'd always know what team you'll be facing after the first show. Plus, what if someone wants to use a 2-man team? Obviously, the fall rule wouldn't apply, but that'd put them at a seemingly-constant disadvantage, since other teams could specifically play to their weaknesses and potential fatigue. I've decided to not actually ALLOW a two-man team as I'm really going for that faction war feel in this. But that's true about the 3-man teams. Very good point. It would take away the strategy for planning against them if you know that only two members are eligible for the next round anyway. So let's turn this dilemna into a positive. Remember how I said I wanted there to be a "handicap" for the 4 man teams since they have the inherent advantage in manpower over 3 man teams? What if that handicap was "predictability". Maybe the 4 man team HAS to abide by the winner/loser "bye week" rule. Whereas the 3 man team doesn't and has the option to choose any two of their members for the next team. That gives them the competitive advantage of not being so easily figured out. Or is that TOO big of a handicap? I do like the idea of giving either individual wrestlers or even whole teams a bye week. We would just need enough teams to make it work, if we were doing teams. I think I'm gonna insist on an even amount of teams for this just so we don't have to worry about any teams being left out for rounds. That just turns into a big planning headache. So I'm not really into giving an entire team an off week, but giving individual members an off week is good. And I think we're making some progress in figuring out how we want to do that in a fair manner. You guys keep this discussion going, I'll be back in two days!
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Post by motosada on Jul 24, 2007 0:33:47 GMT -5
Making 4-man teams abide by the decision rule is a handicap for the 4-man team, but less of a handicap than 3-man teams would face if they also had to operate under the rule.
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Davey
Warp Driver'91
...yare yare...
Posts: 191
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Post by Davey on Jul 24, 2007 0:45:46 GMT -5
I still say we need the International Carnage brought to life somehow. Unfortunately I don't have the skill to do it. Spunk would definately be able to pull it off, Geese? I dunno, but any'ow:
5 man teams Each team fights 4 times 1 Team match and 3 single matches 5 points per team victory 3 points per singles victory 1 point per draw
Each wrestler would be given a condition rating of 100 After each match, their condition will be reworked by match performance(For example, a particularly bad beating would be -40, and a particularly easy win would be -5, average would be -20) Each 15 points off full condition they are, they are deducted 1 point off each defensive ability 1 conditional point gained per day
As you see, while this would be pretty good to do, it'd be pretty annoying to do. Although I think a system like this that involves not just strategic squad rotation, but can even lead to people having to think of who to pick so to safeguard for next week.
While this is completely unrelated to the tag league, I just wanted to get that oot.
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Davey
Warp Driver'91
...yare yare...
Posts: 191
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Post by Davey on Jul 24, 2007 0:48:14 GMT -5
OH! I forgot: CRITICAL! = injured and unusable for however long
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mike
Dark Matter
Posts: 12
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Post by mike on Jul 24, 2007 10:25:39 GMT -5
Brickton Curs? I thought you wanted me to enter face teams to balance the scales, so to speak ...
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Post by OrochiGeese on Jul 25, 2007 17:48:39 GMT -5
Making 4-man teams abide by the decision rule is a handicap for the 4-man team, but less of a handicap than 3-man teams would face if they also had to operate under the rule. Yeah, I agree. So it seems like this is slightly more fair then, right? We have the 4 man teams abide by winner/loser "bye week" to offset their 1 man advantage over the 3 man teams. Brickton Curs? I thought you wanted me to enter face teams to balance the scales, so to speak ... LOL, I thought I did too, now that you mention it. Last week or so has been a blur Really, this tag league seems to be getting a lot bigger and more popular then i initially expected, and I'm really glad to see everyone's enthusiasm With the new factions rule (as opposed to the old 2 man tag idea), i think we actually have more of a face/heel balance then I originally expected. Plus, I think the Curs would fit in really well. But maybe what we should do at this point is for me to make a new thread and we can all list the teams we KNOW will be in, and then we can add additional teams as we see fit. So Freedom Brigade can go in the initial list (you don't need to know all the members yet) and then we'll see if you want the Curs in as well.
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Davey
Warp Driver'91
...yare yare...
Posts: 191
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Post by Davey on Jul 25, 2007 18:04:00 GMT -5
Well unfortunately due to the fact that they're PTFW/Fatman Prowres none of my teams are heel/face. Obviously the addition of Jack Dod to LRI gives a heel feel, but even with him they're still gonna be cheered by "that section" of the crowd... and of course them (paid)Stuart fangirls section.
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